Black Fishing Tagging 2020 New York State

Discussion in 'Commercial Fishermen's Forum' started by RockBottomFish, Oct 27, 2019.

  1. RockBottomFish

    RockBottomFish Senior Member

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    Might be of interest to some.
     

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  2. MarketPrice2020

    MarketPrice2020 Member

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    The rumour I heard is you can only get 25 tags each time you visit DEC? Is this true? I heard they wont mail them out either? Again a rumour I heard.
     
  3. fordy

    fordy Senior Member

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    In RI they're gonna hand out tags based on what you caught last year. You can get more by showing up in person.

    The tagging program sucks but it's already been voted on and not going away.
     
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  4. RockBottomFish

    RockBottomFish Senior Member

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    Take your best of the previous three years and divide that years weight by 3.4 lbs to determine the initial number of tags you will recieve. 340 lbs would equal 100 tags. You can apply for more tags when you use 80 % of your initial allocation. Use 80 out of 100 and request another 100. Your next years initial allocation would now increase.
     
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  5. MarketPrice2020

    MarketPrice2020 Member

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    Thanks guys for the information
     
  6. restless

    restless Captain

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    They are going to issue a license holder a number of tags based on past landing history. When 80% of your tags are used and accounted for they will issue more. I think you have to go pick them up at Gestapo Headquarters. They aren't mailing them. This is what was said at the last meeting.
     
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  7. MarketPrice2020

    MarketPrice2020 Member

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    Thank you for the information capt
     
  8. SidewinderDave

    SidewinderDave Member

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    Rock and Restless were spot on. Although this a “Proposal” by the state I hope a few things change because it will make it a lot easier for both sides.

    what they need to address first is the part about picking up the tags.
    For a new license holder they proposed only 25 tags at a time. So if a five day window of good weather you will be Lucy to get 2 trips in. The time it’s going to take to report the VTR then call ahead to schedule to pick up tags the following day, and drive out east kills another day especially for us fishing to the west that have to make the 2 hr drive out east for tags.

    Also, since it’s the state, they probably have one person assigned to this job of handing out the tags, so when she s sick and u get there and no one else can help you, and they say she’s sick and should be in tomorrow. or since it’s a state job it’s closed on major holidays.

    What I’m getting at it they should give all 300 tags to start and when down to 100 call for another restock. And Ship them. What’s the difference if you give me 300 or 12 blocks of 25.Saves both them and us the hassle and grief
    The potters will get most of the tags and they should never be included in the same category as us rod and reel guys. Because when it finally goes to a poundage down the road the potters will, kill it early and the pinhookers will suffer. That’s why they already have that 3.5lb average number in their heads.

    This is probably the biggest problem with this fishery.
    It’s the poachers and the black market buyers that fuked this it all up.
    There are no real repercussions except, and at best a small fine. Which is made up the first hour poaching again following day out. Hit them with a 10k fine and repo the boat a full season.
    Find the black market buyers and hit them also w huge fines and repo the truck. There is no repercussion of any size for them to think twice.
    This fishery at here off Long Island/NJ is 1/2 as what it used to be.

    It’s almost like a drug dealer..the few times u get pinched w no real penalty.
    Small price to pay for nice cash reward.
    The money to be made far exceeds the risk of a quick pinch, w a small slap on wrist.
    Hire 10 more DEC officers and assign them a poaching task force. I know it won’t stop it but once those first few get caught w BIG fines and Repo, the word will get out then the buyers will think twice and it will make a difference. No doubt.
    But I’m talking Big Fines and a Repo of boat or tank truck.

    For my self I want to do it all right, and when the time comes to purchase a FFL license from one of the Commercial boats I pull for, I’m almost reluctant. A close friend sit on the board (our side) and regarding purchasing a FFL, he basically said “Don’t Do It”
    Better off w a fluke and bass tags.
    Anyway, This is JMHO. Sorry to vent.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
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  9. restless

    restless Captain

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    Dave, I agree with most of what you wrote, but the big fines and seizure of boats and trucks really made me laugh. This is NY. They just released more than a thousand inmates from Riker's Island. They arrested more than 100 MS 13 gang members and immediately released them and gave them gift bags. Laws don't mean much in this pathetic Shit Hole state.
     
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  10. SidewinderDave

    SidewinderDave Member

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    Restless
    I agree with All you wrote. Wishful thinking on my end.
    Makes it More lucrative to be dishonest, thus all the poaching.
    Due to lack of enforcement. All at the hands of the state.
    Why the fishery and licenses will soon be worth nothing.
    They know the problem but don’t want to fix it.

    These tags aren’t gonna do anything. Poachers still gonna poach and buyers gonna buy illegal fish. it’s the reason that drives the prices down w the flooded market.
    All it’s gonna do is try to put a number on the quantity of Legally caught fish.

    Soon the local Police and authorities will trade in their handcuffs for a
    “You hurt my feeling report”. The fishery will never bounce back. So sad!
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  11. Tiderunner 29 h&h

    Tiderunner 29 h&h Member

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    There fucking this whole fishery up with these tags its a shame.... My son has his food fish as well and by time he reaches my age i can only imagine what this will turn into..... I completely agree rod and reel guys should not be in the same category as the potters thats bullshit what they're doing with that. The bay by me is paved with thousands of pots they got everything locked up ... How can you even compare quotas??... Then the brilliant idea of having to personally drive there to get your tags what genius came up with that???....Well be going back and forth non stop... At least make it so i can go and get mine, my sons, and my friends tags for them if they needed. We would all just rotate on who goes each time instead of constantly going.........Then what about towards the end of the season when we are out there in shit weather freezing, fishing deep water. The fish come up looking like shit there fragile you got to really baby them, and now you want me to mess around by there gills putting this tag , so what happens if that fish dies because you know thats going to happen now i just lost a tag for a fish i cant sell. (Heard every fish must be tagged before you get to the dock) There making everything harder and harder .....Dont even get me started on the seabass 50lbs a day is a joke catch that in a half hr ...Barley making any money after fuel and bait
     
  12. SidewinderDave

    SidewinderDave Member

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    The one place on a fish they say to stay away from, we r supposed they want us putting a metal tag an tool near the gills, all at the same time wrestling around w the fish playing w his gill plate. Not every fish likes to be cradled like a football.
    They should have based on off a plastic Zip Tye around the base of tail.
    The part of the near open end could be slightly wider to display number then taper back down if they wanna keep it thin.
    The excess tag after it’s on, you just cut off short as possible.
    It be easier and more effective plus cheaper.
    Fish would be tagged quickly w/o risking harm.
    Once it’s on you can’t get it off without cutting it. They overthink shit all the time.
     
  13. MarketPrice2020

    MarketPrice2020 Member

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    Do you captains feel with the live market, for those who do that method, this tagging method will harm the fish with a possible cause of death? I know it was mentioned above briefly, just have no idea why the fish police come up with such stupid ideas....what's next? Tagging 50lbs of cbass? At least blackfish are a hardy fish most of the year.

    Also how come in the southern states it seems so much easier to get certain licenses? For example I have a friend in mississippi who is a commercial fisherman and you purchase many licenses with just a fee and proof of residency. I dont see any tagging programs going on in those areas? And their fisheries seem to be doing very well .
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
  14. SidewinderDave

    SidewinderDave Member

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    NY is a PIA w everything except a drivers license. That they will give to anyone. Where else in the world can you get the Drivers Test offered in all sorts of different languages yet have all the fixed street, road and exit signs in English.
    But no doubt will some fish die because of the tagging program.

    Yes Blackfish are a hearty fish compared to others. but in my opinion it’s the bigger fish that wind up dying. We have a pretty good survival rating on the boat. Very rarely ever lose a fish.
    But the ones I remember are always DD fish.
    I feel they stress themselves out the most during the fight, more than the smaller fish.

    But at least on the boat I fish on, Capt is cool w even a real mule of 15 lbs or better it is goung back.
    Even if market is at $8-10 a lb its going back home in the water.
    Thats not a common practice when pulling commercially. So thats nice to see.

    Personally, I’d like to see every DD fish go back.
    Quick pop w the needle and a pic for all the “legends” and away she swims.

    Buyers really dont want the big fish anyway since the end consumer doesn't want to pay for a 12-15 lb fish. Buyers would love to pick up a load of fish all under 4 lbs each piece. But I have never seen an issue w not willing to buy because too big.
    u may get a tick better price meaning maybe .50 cents more if most fish are off the smaller size. but not when market is flooded.

    Notice how the price drops when the potting season opens, even up north and during local Recreational season. Once the rec closes it jumps up in price.
    Why....,,because of a flooded market from all the poaching.

    As pinhookers the bigger the better for us since Blackfish is a fixed 25 pieces. Not a daily poundage.
    Soon That will all change, once they try to figure out how many fish are being taken with this tagging program. Then that will go to a daily poundage like Seabass in my opinion
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
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  15. MarketPrice2020

    MarketPrice2020 Member

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    I agree with everything you say. I commercial fish and work on a charter boat part time. Still learning every day and still young at this wonderful art of fishing. That's why I value everyone's opinions on this forum. I looked and read a lot over a few years and then finally opened an account. Glad I did. Plus it helps pass the winter since bay scallops were a bust. I scalloped until end of December. But thanks for all the nice info. Nothing better then listening and reading from capts who have been doing it for a long time! April cant come soon enough!
     
  16. SidewinderDave

    SidewinderDave Member

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    No problem. Thats JMHO and what i have personally witnessed.
    Believe me, I know there are many guys in this forum that are more Salty than I am on this subject.
    Im sure they will agree and can tell stories of how much better the fishing was years ago compared to now.
     
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